Yep, this pretty much sums it up. (Screen capture from @SuperManTDJesus)
So where do we even start with Notre Dame’s debacle in Pittsburgh last night?
Perhaps we could start with Tommy Rees. Tommy, quite frankly, had one of his worse games in his career at ND. He may have had 300+ yards through the air, but he did so with a sub-50% completion rate and 2 INTs which may have been two of the worst balls that I’ve ever seen him throw. One of these came in the endzone and when Notre Dame was on Pitt’s 2 yard line no less.
Or perhaps we could point to T.J. Jones’ costly fumble on the door step of the endzone earlier in the game. The game was tied in the early stages of the second quarter and Notre Dame could have likely taken a 14-7 lead. The defense did manage to send Pitt packing on a three and out in the resulting drive and ND did score. Could ND have gone up 21-7 at this point and put Pitt in panic mode?
Or perhaps we should point at the entire defensive line seemingly falling asleep while a fumble bounced around at their feet. There was no whistle on the play and no one moved until the Pitt sideline screamed that the ball was live. Just two weeks earlier, Jaylon Smith, a freshman grabbed a fumble and ran it into the endzone post-whistle.
Maybe the ejection of Stephon Tuitt for playing football targeting (more on that later) was simply too much for the defense to overcome, especially one that is still reeling from multiple injuries.
Was it a poor gameplan? After Folston seemingly grabbed the spotlight, he only saw 4 of Notre Dame’s 23 rushes — T.J. Jones, a wide receiver, got only one less rushing attempt. In comparison, Rees threw 38 times and was sacked once leading to 63% pass on the night.
And despite all that, the Irish still had a chance to steal this game away from Pitt. However, it was simply one mistake after another and the Irish simply couldn’t get out of their own way en route to a 28-21 loss, crushing all remaining hopes for one final shot at a BCS Bowl victory.
There’s plenty of blame to pass around from Rees to Chuck Martin to Brian Kelly (the handling of the final timeouts at the end in particular drove me nuts). And there’s plenty of reason to be angry. The entire performance was one of the worst overall that we’ve seen since Kelly started his tenure at Notre Dame. The Irish lacked the kind of composure that you’d expect from a team that was previously 10-0 in single possession games since 2012. A team that has seen considerable success in November looked like they were in the first couple of weeks in the season.
To be frank, the game was a complete and total disaster. The fact that the Irish even had a shot in this game was more a factor of Pitt being a bad football team than the Irish coming close to overcoming their mistakes. I’m not going to attempt to put a positive spin on this game and say there is a silver lining because there isn’t one for this game.
This is, however, one game. The bigger test for this team in my mind is how Notre Dame and Brian Kelly approach the bye week and BYU.
The last time that I felt this down about Notre Dame was in 2010 when Notre Dame laid an egg against Navy and then followed that up with a soul-crushing loss to Tulsa. Notre Dame had a bye week after those two games and responded by not just upsetting Utah, but winning convincingly. They followed that up with wins against Army and Southern Cal.
I want to see something similar in 2013. I want to see them respond and finish this thing out strong. Come out flat, and I’m going to have some serious concerns.
With all that said, let’s get to the “targeting” that got Tuitt ejected. Here is the rule, direct from the NCAA Rulebook. Rules 9-1-3 and 9-1-4 detail what constitutes a targeting personal foul. 9-1-4 is likely the rule you’re most familiar with as it details a dangerous hit to a defensive player:
No player shall target and initiate contact to the head or neck area of a defenseless opponent with the helmet, forearm, hand, fist, elbow or shoulder. When in question, it is a foul (Rules 2-27-14 and 9-6).
Now what’s a defenseless player?
Note 2: Defenseless player (Rule 2-27-14):
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A player in the act of or just after throwing a pass.
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A receiver attempting to catch a pass, or one who has completed a catch and has not had time to protect himself or has not clearly become a ball carrier.
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A kicker in the act of or just after kicking a ball, or during the kick or the return.
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A kick returner attempting to catch or recover a kick.
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A player on the ground.
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A player obviously out of the play.
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A player who receives a blind-side block.
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A ball carrier already in the grasp of an opponent and whose forward progress has been stopped.
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A quarterback any time after a change of possession.
So, a quarterback running is not defenseless. That leaves 9-1-3 which states:
No player shall target and initiate contact against an opponent with the crown (top) of his helmet. When in question, it is a foul. (Rule 9-6)
And this is where the refs both on the field and in the booth were convinced that Tuitt did. The problem though is that Tuitt leads with his shoulder while Savage is still upright. Tuitt has to do this because he’s a giant in comparison and he must do so in order to make proper contact (yes, what he did isn’t perfect tackling form, but he still has to duck down). Not only that, Tuitt puts his head at a 45-degree angle in relation to Savage’s body as well — again, he wants the hit to be his shoulder, not his head.
When Savage sees Tuitt coming, he ducks his head down, at a 45-degree angle away from Tuitt’s, but in doing so leads it directly towards Tuitt’s head. Yet somehow, Tuitt is flagged and ejected for being the one that “led” with his helmet. There is no way that this is ejection worthy.
What really drives me nuts is that, even if the refs say it’s “the letter of the law”, Amir Carlisle suffered an actual targeting violation that wasn’t called. Amir dropped a pass and was immediately speared by a defender that 100% led with the crown of his helmet, yet there was no flag.
This rule is an absolute joke and needs to be seriously shored up if they are considering letting it live past this season. There is too much left to interpretation, going as far to say “if in doubt, throw the flag” which puts the referees in an awful spot. When they throw that flag because “welp, it was close!” then the booth has to find indisputable evidence to overturn the ejection.
It’s a ridiculous standard and adds even more frustration to an already infuriating loss.
Ryan Ritter
Texan by birth, Irish by choice.
Born and raised in the great state of Texas, Tex is a first-generation Domer and a former student manager. After graduation, he left the cold winters of South Bend behind and returned back to his home state with a computer engineering degree in tow. Missing the daily grind of working football practices and talking football with fellow Irish fans every day, he took to blogging, a path which eventually led him to Her Loyal Sons. Continuously diving into stats and game film, Tex strives to break down every aspect of Fighting Irish football--even though it's determined to kill him.
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Cannot understand not playing Folsten. With all the attention Folsten received last week Kelly does not play him. Kelly law number 1. No one gets more attention than Kelly.
Really hoping the like votes here are all Poot.
My question is why Savage was not also flagged for targeting and both should then be ejected. Savage lowered his head to attack Tuitt.
Kelly’s refusal to play Folston amounts to coaching malpractice. He will use “coachspeak” such as using “different personnel groupings” or going according to the “flow of the game”, but that is patent nonsense. Folston had his definitive breakout game a week ago against Navy and there is no valid reason for his absence last night. He is clearly our best back. Pitt did not have to stop Folston–Kelly did!
It’s spelled F-O-L-S-T-E-N and the reason he didn’t play was because Coach didn’t want him getting too much attention.
It’s F-O-L-S-T-O-N! Check the roster and the spelling. The object of the game is to win. To do that you have to use your best players regardless of how much attention they get.
WOOOOOOOOOSH
I realized this morning what angered me so much. It’s the fact that this years team doesn’t do “the little things” that BK has preached about since he got to ND. The secondary(Bennett) is constantly out of position with their backs to the ball. Tackling as a whole is embarrassing. Farley’s missed arm tackle in the 2nd half was seriously horrible.
The O-line constantly misses blocks in the running game. We all know Ree’s short comings. He still stares down his receiver. Throws hi, throws late, and throws into double coverage. On top of all this, the play calling has been an epic fail all season. I could go on and on, speaking about situation after situation where Martin calls mind boggling plays.
I’ve supported BK since he got to ND. I still do. If we don’t see a staff shake up after this year, the next couple of seasons could be rough. BK needs to put people in place that teach those “details” he loves to talk about. BK needs to take over the play calling again unless he can find someone who will at least call a QB sneek when it’s 1st and goal inside the 1.
I am as unhappy with the result as anyone, but as usual, reactions are over the top. I want to remind everyone of a simple but overlooked fact-its a game with uncertainties. Our best player(TJ) had an uncharacteristic fumble. He’s entitled. He’s earned that right. Troy fell down on a sure completion at the end. It happens. The most unusual was the D not playing til the whistle on the fumble. Very weird, but crazy things happen.
If any one of those 3 things didn’t happen we probably win. None of those 3 plays had anything to do with coaching.
Now, Tommy’s first int was a terrible decision, and one I thought he had grown out of. But why can’t we run it in from the two?
For those who want Kelly’s head, my first reaction is that it is the D scheme that is letting us down. Jaylon should be blitzing with some regularity as should Shumate. Too late now, but Farley should not be playing at all.
You do need some luck to run the table, and last year we had it. This year we don’t.
Some people treat every loss like it is an unthinkable disaster and solely because of poor coaching decisions. That would be true if our typical year was 11-1, which obviously is not average.
I think Coach Kelly is a 10-2 type coach, and when things align we can go 12-0, and when things go badly its 8-4.
For all the over reactions it appear that people assumed this was another 12-0 team. It wasn’t, but it still is a good team making lots of progress (freshmen all over the place) Next year 12-0 will be possible.
Stay positive.
People aren’t expecting 12-0 this year, people were expecting to not have only a 4 point difference from Old Dominion in how much we lost to Pitt by.
I’m very positive about Notre Dame from a program perspective. I think the future is bright and I think Kelly has done a solid job building the program and it will show in future years.
However, I am mad as hell about this game. I will remain mad until Monday most likely and will start to look at things in a more objective fashion and look forward to BYU.
I agree that there are some opinions on the internet that are way overboard; however, being pissed at this loss is perfectly fine. Criticizing the play of the team is fine. Criticizing the coaching is fine. Personal attacks on both groups for irrational reasons is not and there is a big difference between the two.
Our failings this year haven’t been bad luck, it’s been bad play and last night was some of the worst play I’ve seen from ND in the Kelly era. Period. Full Stop.
But like I said, I can compartmentalize this game. Finish the year strong and this game is an exception and not the rule. I can handle that. What I won’t handle is watching the team continue to slide from this game and have it affect the rest of the year.
I don’t believe that’ll happen, personally, but if it does, it’ll be time to ask some very serious questions.
“But why can’t we run it in from the two?”
Because Rees’ inability to take a snap from the center means it becomes a run from about the seven. Seriously, every time we get the ball down into the five there’s Rees running the play from the shotgun. Drives me nuts.
That makes zero sense. Even if Rees is taking the snap from under center (which he has done, pretty sure he is able to do this), he runs back towards the RB. Same with the pistol, but to a lesser degree.
So you might “gain” one or two yards in those cases. The only difference is that you can start “running downhill” easier in those formations.
Now, I’d prefer that to operate in that fashion as well, but running from the shotgun doesn’t automatically equal failure.
Makes perfect sense. What I’m saying is how often have you seen him under center near the goal line? Something I’ve definitely noticed. Do you really want that kind of a buffer when the defense is stuffing 8-9 men in a box? Just sayin.
WHY ARE SPECIAL TEAMS SO POOR? WHY CAN’T WE DEFEND THE BUBBLE SCREEN? WHY CAN’T THE D-BACKS TURN AND PLAY THE BALL ON LONG PASS PLAYS?
I DON’T KNOW
WHY ARE WE SHOUTING?
[img]http://i.imgur.com/EWFzV.gif[/img]
Being that I’m all-caps-dyslexic, your post read “I understand teams don’t always play their best and coaches don’t always call the greatest games. I nevertheless support the Irish and hope they rebound against BYU”. I couldn’t have said it better myself.
Tex;
I do like your measured comments. I agree that it was a poor game overall. I am very satisfied with Coach Kelly, but separately I am down on Diaco and to a lesser extent Hiestad. Why the hell can we not run the ball? Navy and Air Force don’t count. They do pass block very well.
Cam had his first bad game, and Tommy was clearly off a bit. But as i said, if even one of the freak plays doesn’t happen (never mind the Tuitt bs) we win.
I know that you and the saner heads on this board acknowledge that 3 years ago the lunatic fringe would have taken Stoops in a heartbeat, whereas now, Kelly looks just as good (or bad, depending on your viewpoint) Without making it an exhaustive list, the following major programs have fan bases that want to see a coach fired. Michigan, florida, Texas, Nebraska, ND, OKla. What do all those teams have in common? A fan base expectation that 11-12 wins is a minimum, and that it is incredibly easy to accomplish! Not quite.
Here is an interesting question for you to consider- if we had actually beaten Bama last year and then went 8-5 this year, would most people be happy or would they be just as bitter?
I seriously worry about the sanity of some of those guys.
Keep up the good work.
I agree with your comment about unrealistic fan bases. Is 8 – 4 such a terrible result when we lost our starting quarterback before the season even began? Not to mention all of the hits we’ve taken on defense . . . I know the motto is “next man in,” but realistically, after awhile the loss of starting talent and experience takes a huge toll.
That being said, I’ve always admired Tommy’s grit and I think he could have gotten us to 10 – 2 or better, IF our defense had stayed dominant. So in that sense, this season is a “disappointment” — but only relative to this year’s team not reaching its full potential. In no way is our overall program is in trouble.
A comparison to Michigan is instructive. They have the same record we do and beat us this year, but their fan base is losing its collective mind right now — and they may be right. Shaky wins against lesser programs, domination by Michigan State, and an ineffective offensive effort against Nebraska — they look like a program in the middle of imploding. Anything can happen, but it’s hard to imagine them beating OSU. And worse for them, it feels like their problems are systemic and not necessarily going to get better next year.
By contrast ND has several solid wins and has been competitive in all of its games with the possible exception of Oklahoma (even there, after the initial disasters, we settled down and played decently — it was just too much to overcome). Yes, in theory we should be able to beat Pitt most years, but like BC, they thrive on playing us and it’s always a tough game. That’s nothing new, and in fact I remember that going back to at least the Holtz era. We’ll likely beat BYU, and although Stanford will probably win, an upset is still possible and I expect we’ll at least give them a game. And I fully expect we’ll be an even better team next year.
But the biggest thing for me is that when I watch an ND game these days, I start out expecting us to win most of the time and believe we’ll at least compete no matter what. I couldn’t say that in the last few years of the Weiss era; back then, even when we won it felt like we had totally lucked out and stolen it from the other, better team (which was practically everyone we played by that point; notice I said better TEAM, not more talented team. It really did get to the point where the whole was less than the sum of its parts for us — how quickly some people seem to have forgotten that . . . . ). It’s been great not feeling that way the last few years.
OK, I went back and checked the series record, and I need to amend my comment about the series being close back to the Holtz era before someone with a better memory calls me out on it; I remember it that way, but I think it’s because we lost to Pitt in ’87 (my freshman year at ND) and it must have made a big impression. :-). Most of the games for the next ten years weren’t that close score-wise, although I seem to remember Pitt playing us tough a few times.
Many have downplayed Tuitt’s ejection. With the defensive line so thin, it was a major setback for the Irish. The whole team was affected. And we have to play several ACC teams each year from now on. I surely hope Coach Kelly has filed a complaint on this. These refs were totally incompetent. ND was clearly winning until that call.
I’ve been around long enough ( since 1954 ) to remember with great regularity that Pitt has been a consistent thorn in our side. We could be having a great season ( think last year ) and Pitt will take us to the wood shed and leave us wondering what hit us. This most recent game is just another example of the wonders of long rivalries with a ton of tradition and I will always appreciate the games played against this background. And let’s face it folks, the sun did come up on Sunday morning.
I wish a lot of the comments here would stop sugarcoating a team that has not looked good from the first game, and the defense hardly all year. Like it or not, that’s coaching. I could never figure out how we could have possibly beaten Alabama last year when our head coach was interviewing even before the game. Kelly is in it for Kelly, not ND.
Whitecoat
ND ’62
I wish we could have people not making huge assumptions about Kelly and not flip out over every little thing, but hey, we all can’t get what we want.
Whitecoat,
Have yourself a warm glass of milk and go to bed.
Kelly needs to go…very poor coaching :
–all year long, our tackling has been awful..this is football, you need to tackle.
–Special teams are terrible…
–so many of the decisions during the game are just wrong
–why don’t we have a better defense, even without Manti Teo
WJA ’76
Yes, let’s fire the coach that led this team to it’s first shot at a title in a quarter of a century. Brilliant!
I think we were all a bit naive before the season to expect that a once-in-a-generation player would be replaced easily. Tackling (proper angles and alignments) and in-game decisions (formations/spacing) can be attributed to both good coaching and a singular talent at linebacker.
@Bill
Derp, derp, herpidy-DERP.
Re: the targeting rule. Before the season one of the top conference officials was talking about how their attitude concerning this would be “when in doubt, throw them out.” I guess the jokes on me since I didn’t take it that seriously. The NFL is trying to legislate defense out of the league, why not college. How are guys on defense supposed to account for level changes that ball carriers make,… absolutely retarded. Short of a new rule that says ball carriers must remain in an upright form, there’s little chance this won’t keep happening. Counsell once, now Tuitt.
Gotta ramble without making much of a point for a bit.
Watching the last couple games I have had the same image running through my head… Keanu Reeves sitting in a lockerroom talking about being affraid of quicksand.
In the three losses Tommy has 6 TDs and 7 INTs. In the wins he has 18 Tds and 3 INTS. Except for the 2 picks in the Air Force game, those three losses have had had multiple picks.
The Coaches feel after a point when they guys get down, they can’t run the ball. They have to throw. It is like that at every level of the game from Pee-Wee to the NFL.
After watching Oklahoma, Michigan, and Pitt in their other games there is now doubt we could have won those games. Tommy just has to keep his mind straight. He isn’t a McCarron or Manziel. He can’t afford to make mistakes.
LETS START YELLING AGAIN!
Simply a disaster for a BCS aspirational team like ND to lose to an awful Pitt team. We looked disinterested and not very fired up. Looked like we were already enjoying the off-week and not focused on business. Good teams don’t lose that game. We’re a mediocre team that consistently makes the same mistakes. Yep, we got a little luckly last year to go 12-0, but we had the fire ALL season and played hard and pretty smart for the duration. This year, it’s simply not there. Blame goes everywhere, but I’d start with the guy in charge … Mr Kelly. How can you NOT question whether he’s the long-term solution?? How many teams straight off playing in the national title game and look like crap the very next season??? I can think of two: Auburn who lost SCam Newton to the NFL … and this ND team.
Texas – went to BCS title in 2009, lost to Alabama 37-21 and finished their 2010 campaign with a 5-7 record (only Kansas was worse in the Big XII)
Oklahoma – went to BCS title in 2008, lost to Florida 24-14 and finished the following season 7-5 and got a Sun Bowl Birth.
LSU – went to the BCS title in 2007 and WON. Finished the following season 7-5 and went to the Chik-Fil-A bowl.
Oklahoma once again! – went to BCS title in 2004 and got smoked by USC. Finished the following season 7-4 and went to the Pacific Life Bowl
Nebraska – Went to the BCS title in in 2001 and lost 37-14 to Miami. Finished the following season 7-5, then lost the Big XII title game, and then lost the Independence Bowl, finishing 7-7 overall.
I’m sure I could go on, but the point is teams can reach the pinnacle and then have to reload the next year. It happens. College football is cyclical and dynasties are incredibly rare.
If only there was an avenue for people to look up teams’ previous records… I am using the internet, correct?
I think last year was a bit of a fluke, the breaks went our way all year long and we won several games we probably should have lost. Ok that is football, and this year we are not getting many breaks. I live in the Southeast and the loss last year to Bama was bad, and showed how far we have to go to realistically think about a National Championship and I felt that Kelly did not prepare the team well for that game. I soured on Kelly when he then talked to the Eagles. With Teo and Golston out, I did not expect that we would be in contention again this year, but I did expext a lot better that we are doing, BYU and Stanford are going to be 2 more losses. As i said initially, Kelly is not taking care of fundamentals, tackling and special teams have been bad all year long
Well, damn, guess the season’s over. Let’s pack it up, finish 7-5, and not go to a bowl game. Why bother?
Also, I wasn’t aware Golston somehow doubled time between Sparty and us. Weird.
This is a follow-up to our earlier discussion. I assume it was not lost on anyone that North Carolina beat Pitt easily on Saturday, what is wrong with the Irish to lose to Pitt and then NC handles Pitt easily. ND has the talent, what we lack is good coaching, coaches that have fire in their guts. If we cannot fire Kelly, can we please fire Diaco?
PS. in my earlier comment I meant Golson, misspelled his name, but the comment was nonetheless valid.
WJA ’76
What isn’t lost on me is that the transitive property doesn’t work in college football.
We beat USC who just beat Stanford. Should we just go ahead and claim the win?
Oh and don’t forget, we beat Michigan State who beat Michigan yet we lost to Michigan.
Sports isn’t played on paper and doesn’t happen in a vacuum. Bad games happen and you don’t fire coaches because players prove to be human and imperfect on occasion.
Who the fuck is Golston? Did he play on the same team as Mauti Teow?
It’s bad enough when ESPN commentators can’t get our players’ names right but these people are supposedly fans.
“You’re never as good as everyone tells you when you win, and you’re never as bad as they say when you lose.” – Lou Holtz
“In the modern era, running up win streaks is difficult. This is unusual because of the balance there is in college football. The population explosion has given, in my opinion, better facilities and coaching techniques has produced outstanding talent for a lot of teams.” – Ara Parseghian
THIS NEVER WOULD HAVE HAPPENED WHEN ARA WAS COACHingohshootnevermind
“I need a drink.”- KyNDfan
First Folsten and then Golston??? i think I’m a fan of a different team…
All you really need to know about that train wreck was choosing a second and 6 over first and 15. Was Kelly drunk on Saturday?