Have at it in the comments:
1) The team came out super flat. No doubt about it. Is this on the players, coaches, or both?
My answer: 100% both. I don’t know how a player doesn’t come out ready to play, and I don’t know how a coach doesn’t have them ready.
2) The pumped in music was polarizing to say the least. Does it need to go? Should it stay? Does it not matter?
My answer: I think it should stay, but the execution needs improvement. ND needs to have what the music can bring at times, but they need to pick the right moments. For me, it’s about pre-kick-off, commercial breaks, returning from half time, and select, key moments in the game. Certainly not every 3rd down. They need to use the good of that system, but also respect the band and what they do for us. (Band also need to be mic’d).
They also need to find the right songs for Notre Dame, and they need to bring in someone that can feel it out – there can’t be rules about ‘if 3rd down, play Crazy Train over and over no matter what’. Find a great DJ or radio person that gets this kind of thing, and trust him/her to execute within a tightly defined set of songs that really fit ND’s brand and style.
3) ND got beat pretty badly. Was this a self-inflicted loss, or were we simply out-played? Or both?
My answer: It’s a bit of both, I think. ND was outplayed in the first half, hands down. In the second half, we played a pretty even game with SC, but self-inflicted turnovers killed that resurgence. Net-net, I’d say that SC is the first team that beat ND this year. But they got a helping hand from an Irish team that simply loves to turn over the ball at the worst time possible, over and over. I have no idea what the answer is to this – either stop it, or we’ll never be good.
4) Is Brian Kelly the right Coach for Notre Dame?
My answer: This is a stupid question to ask half way through his second season. It doesn’t deserve a proper response.
5) What’s left for ND to play for this year?
My answer: PLEN-TY. People saying the season is over, and plan for next year, etc, are clueless. Last year after Tulsa, people were saying the same thing. Then we pulled off a streak to end the season and everything took on a new light – it resulted in a good bowl win and some solid recruiting returns. You plan for and prep for the future by winning today. If ND rips off a bunch of wins, including an upset over top-ranked Stanford to close out the year, we have momentum. We have momentum for recruiting, and for a good bowl berth, and for development of the team and players.
We’re a 4-3 team that had little/no margin for error. Sadly, we dropped 2 games early that we should have very easily won (remember, we gave away 55 points and lost by a combined 7 points in USF/UM). Outside of those 2 losses themselves, that killed ND’s ability to absord a loss and not have it look horrible. Yeah, 4-3 and a loss to USC at home at night looks horrible, but it wouldnt look half as bad had it been the first loss of the year and ND sitting at 6-1 and still Top 20. We’re still 2 weird plays away from that reality, and this team is still the same team.
Play to win, play to learn, play to build momentum for the future. But that means winning today, above all else. More important than winning against Stanford is beating Navy. More important than getting young guys more time is beating Navy. More important than anything else anyone can say, think or do, is beating Navy.
Just beat Navy. Then win some more. But only after beating Navy.
Don't take me, yourself, or life so seriously. This is supposed to be fun.
Biscuit co-founded HerLoyalSons in partnership with his ND roommate (Dillon Hall baby!), MQ, in 2006 and has been ranting about ND Football and everything Notre Dame since. He strongly believes in the mission of ND and its football program. Biscuit expects logic and data in arguments and will absolutely crush you if you come to a debate missing one or the other. He despises everything Michigan, and his favorite pastime is mocking Purdue.
- (Re)Introducing: DANCING LEPRECHAUNS - August 29, 2019
- Ticket Auction: ND vs USC - August 22, 2019
- No Respect! - December 14, 2018
All very good answers.
As far as the music, how did they not know that having only three songs was a terrible idea? What a half-assed effort all around on whomever green lit that project.
My question would be, did ND look past SC?
JB
I certainly agree with #1, 3 & 4. Flat on O and D. They committed errors that we saw before the 4 game win streak. Not much ground game but then SC was stacked against the run. And SC came out pretty strong and capitalized on our mistakes.
While I agree for the most part about the music, my 17 yr old nephew attended the game with me, wants to go to ND, was in the stands about 30 mins before the start and thought the lyrics in the music were inappropriate. And that’s a 17 yr old! Sorry; I’ll show my age but gangsta rap isn’t appropriate for most families with kids one hopes will embrace the culture & spirit of ND. As to what’s left for the ND season, EVERYTHING. Maybe bowl games, maybe not. But every game those young men play speaks to their spirit & dedication. I look to the Irish to continue to work, continue to fight & continue to grow for the future. I’ll be in the stands for Navy & look forward to the win!
Ken
I wasn’t there so i didn’t hear what they played pregame. What ‘gangsta rap’ was played?
pre-game music isn’t what we’re talking about here. They’ve played almost the exact same pre-game mix for every game for the last five years and it’s never been an issue. It’s stuff like Lose Yourself by Eminem.
Biscuit is referring to the music played during the game.
I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. I agreed with the basic premise that Hornung was trying to get across. If you want to attract the top athletes, some things need to change. If that means playing music that a player relates to, so be it. The music pre-game isn’t there to entertain you. It is there to pump the guys up. Do I like all the music they play? Not always. But, really….the whole gameday thing isnt about the fan “experience” it’s about the players and giving them whatever they want to help them perform.
Mayhem
In theory, I agree regarding the music. Having said that, I always temper my love for ND football with the thought that ND is about much MORE than the football. FWIW
Irish72’s comment is as irrational as it is disrepectful and bigoted. His choice of language and intolerance has no place in this forum. Such derogatory comments about a person’s sexual orientation only reveal his ignorance and insensitivity to others. This site is supposed to be an intelligent discussion on ND football, not a place to spew your bigotry.
His comment will be deleted momentarily. This isn’t tolerated.
I’d like to second your stance on Coach Kelly.
People who are saying the Kelly is to blame for ANY of these losses are fools who are too used to blaming NDs coaches. Granted, not without good reason.
However, its only been flukey turnovers that have killed us. We have not been out coached.
And yes, some turnovers ARE a coaches fault for not teaching discipline. This only applies to interceptions in my opinion. And we have a sophomore QB. He’s gonna throw picks.
Fumbling a snap is not a coaches fault. Getting the ball punched out of a RBs hand is not the coaches fault. Its football. It happens.
However, we have had some stunningly bad turnovers this year, and at amazingly inopportune times. But none of these, minus some developmental issues with a young QBs interceptions, can be blamed on Kelly.
Our players are losing the games. Not the coach. We haven’t been out coached yet. Just outplayed.
Of course not all turnovers are mistakes by the coach. I would submit that the mindset is something the coaches instill. Gray made a fumble against USF. I thought that fumble was not on Gray but on good D by USF. However, the team’s mindset fell apart after that. Kelly and the coaches have to instill in the leaders that is the time when the “tough get going”. Envision yourselves in the endzone instead of envisioning yourselves fumbling, missing tackles, etc. Mistakes happen but an inordinate amount is happening to ND and a lot of that is on the coaches. Look what happened to Greg Louganis (sp?) did after he hit his head on the diving board. He raised his level and won 2 golds. Great teams do this. ND folds.
I think Kelly would agree that a team’s mindset is a coach’s job. I think it’s inarguable that the “mindset” of the program has been an issue with great regularity sine 94.
Notre Dame teams and fans used to have that “Mindset”. They KNEW they were going to win. That all went out the window on that November night in ’93 when David Gordon kicked the football right between Touchdown Jesus-es eyeballs. Now it seems both players and fans lose the will to compete at the first sign of adversity as if it’s pre ordained.
I’d like to ask the current players when the last time was that they lined up across from the opponent in front of them and KNEW they were going to kick his A$$!
Air Force. 2.3 weeks ago.
You know, I study the martial art of Kempo. When I make a mistake, I do not dwell on it. When you dwell on things, a bad mindset creeps in and, before you know it, you’re in a downward spiral of mistakes. I totally agree with you.
Once I make a mistake, I envision the opposite. The next time, it usually is the opposite 9 of 10 times.
One turnover is a fluke. 3-5 per game (USF, UM,USC) represent a trend and problem that must be corrected with better discipline or different players.
TO’s are not flukes. They are fundamentals. This is coaching. Good teams do not turn over. Ergo, we are not a good team.
Fumbling was due to Crist being in there.
The coach is the CEO. We have talent on par with almost anyone. We have been outcoached in: Tulsa 2010. Navy 2010. Mich 2011 (improper personnel and defensive scheme). Pitt 2011 (we won but our scheme was poor). USC 2011 (the perfect defensive scheme and ND’s failed scheme).
We were outcoached repeatedly.
We examine our elected officials continuously. We should do the same for our football coach.
100% with you on all of this, but you probably knew that already.
Losses are funny. Would we really feel any better if we had been 6-0 and ranked 8th? I don’t think so. In fact we would probably feel worse and in truth, the loss would seem even worse.Apparently the SC boys were crowing publicly today, and all returning players should take note.
I believe Kelly is the right man for the long term, but I am as frustrated as anyone.
I do think this closes the book on Crist and Coach will amp up Hendrix’ reps.
As I said below, I think Coach adapts and will promote Jonas to first string.
There have to be some consequences for poor performances, and I trust Coach to motivate the boys with the right combination of fear and encouragement.Lets crush Navy
Thanks for this post Biscuit…finally some sense from all the stupidity being posted by other Irish sites.
turnovers,lazy D, and overhype are the new hallmarks of Notre Dame football.
Yeah, that “lazy D” has been a real hallmark. Do you typically galavant around in public with baseless statements, or save it all for this website?
I don’t get this. The Defense has been dominant, arguably, since the Utah game of last season.
You get it. I get it. Matt Q also gets it. The defense did not lose the game. Turnovers and self-inflicted wounds lost this game. COME ON IRISH!!!
You’re a clown who has no clue.
They won’t be erecting a bronze statue of Coach Kelly for the Stadium. I predict in 3 years he will be fired. This game probably set us back a minimum of 6 years if not more. All our coaches who won the National Championship did it in their 3rd year. That can’t happen with Kelly, because after this game if we were to go undefeated next year, we will start the season unranked or ranked so low, we’ll never get into the BCS Championship game. Besides we had a boatload of recuits their to watch us get embarased.
Kelly has lost way too many games he shuldn’t have already (this year and last). The good coaches have had their problems but turned them around real fast. Kelly is in over his head, this is big time football, not Cincinnati or that Division whatever school. Question: how many times in the next twenty years or so do you think we will get Michigan and USC both unranked in the same season? We blew a real opportunity.
And after season 2 we were starting plans for Weis’ statue. It’s too soon to make such sweeping statements that have zero basis in reality.
Regarding another NC, it doesn’t have to happen in year three. Just because that’s how it was done before by pure coincidence means nothing.
I wouldn’t worry about recruits. Floyd and Te’o are on this squad after having official visits during awful losses. I kept an eye on them throughout the game. The majority were standing, taking pictures, cheering, and seemed to have a good time despite the loss.
To end, call me crazy, but I’d prefer to win a title with everyone in our way ranked as high as possible. This line of thought that we can only do it with a weak schedule makes no sense. Ask Ohio State how that works out.
Great reminder about the Weis statue. And remember Willingham was many sources coach of the year candidate year 1, so lets let it play out ab it longer.
6 years??? Where did you pull that number from? And if that’s the case, why does it take 3 years to fire Kelly? Embarrassed? Not really. Anyone remember the 38-0 blowout? That was embarrassing. This team came out flat and didn’t seem to wake up until the 2nd half. Then a 14 point turnover sucked the life out of them. Kelly’s play-calling certianly didn’t help (Rees running the option was dreadful) but I think the boys might have been wrapped up in all the hype and underestimated USC. But I think they will come back and spank Navy. Look at the edge they played with after starting 0-2. I think this team has to play like they can’t get respect instead of people talking about BCS games. They need to play Mark May “analysis” on a continuous loop to give them a chip on their shoulder.
Long-term, Kelly has shown enough improvement in 2 years to keep me optimistic. He can recruit, he represents ND well and seems to be a good head coach. Play-calling, x’s and o’s, etc. can be debated ad nauseum but he looks like he knows how to run a program.
One final point: ND could be ranked 112th pre-season and if they go undefeated they will be in the hunt for a BCS title. And that is because Michigan and USC are usually highly ranked every year. I agree with NDtex, I hope our opponents are ranked 1-12 b/c competition makes you better. Also, part of the reason we still get highly ranked recruits (even after 3-9 seasons) is b/c ND plays in high profile games with national exposure. When Michigan and USC are unranked it hurts ND. First night game in South Bend in two decades and where was ESPN Gameday???
OK, I agree with you on most of this (especially the point about our pre-season ranking not mattering much if we go undefeated), but I have to point out that it wouldn’t make much sense for ESPN game day to be at a game that isn’t airing on ESPN — doubt they would be welcome anyway, due to our deal with NBC.
Aside from which, as important as it was to fans like us, both teams were unranked, and there were a lot bigger games going on in terms of the national title picture . . . I can blame ESPN for lots of things, but gotta be fair on that one . . .
Good post, great read. A lot of people need to sit down and take a deep breath. Seven games in and ND is 4 & 3. It could be 6 & 1, however if if’s and but’s were candy and nuts we’d all have a merry christmas. Folks, there are 5 games to be played 4 of which ND has a pretty damn good chance of winning with the exception being Stanford. With an unlikely win at Stanford and a bowl win they finish up at 10 & 3, a marked improvement over last season. Even with a loss at Stanford and a win in a bowl it still an improvement over last year at 9 & 4. Self inflicted wounds are the bane of ND’s existence this season however, these missteps can be resolved. I don’t recall anyone asking for Lou’s head halfway through his second season and then again we didn’t have “net”. GO IRISH beat the middies and lets get this thing on a roll before they head west to Northern California.
GO IRISH
I think most seem to forget that Lou was 13-10 after two full seasons. My, the sky is falling, isn’t it? :o)
I wish the USC game closed the book on Rees. We will not be effective on offense against a good defense with the offense limited by Rees shortcomings. I would’ve rather seen Crist in there these past 7 games. Since Kelly hates him, lets see what Hendrix can do.
Kelly not playing Crist doesn’t have anything to do with hating or loving anyone. I think it’s plain to see that while he is enormously physically talented, he comes apart under pressure. And this is coming from someone who thought it was CRAAAAZY that people were calling for Rees to start from preseason. Dayne has had numerous spots to step up and be the man (filling in for Clausen, last year prior to his injury, USF, and now USC) and has not impressed in any of them.
Moving to Hendrix now would be effectively giving up on the season and is a ridiculous idea. Increase his role in the offense, sure, but it’s obvious he’s not ready to be leading the team through an entire game.
I agree on Hendrix and think Rees has, at times, played very well (at other times, very poorly). But Crist not impressing on any occasion? He outplayed the rest of the team last year in the games he started (per analysis posted here) and the offense put up more points per game with him behind center than with Rees up until the Air Force game (offensive ppg are now slightly higher with Rees, but barely). He’s had two glaring errors this season (plus a few poor decisions in the 1st half against USF), from which he’s not been given a chance to turn around. The red zone offense under Crist was worlds better last year (and under Rees last year, as well – 49th in the nation in 2010 to 110th this year).
I understand the feeling that Kelly has treated Crist unfairly. Tons of players have given up points through mistakes this season or turned the ball over at critical moments: Tommy Rees, Gary Gray, Dayne Crist, Jonas Gray, Theo Riddick, Cierre Wood, Lo Wood, Carlo Calabrese, Aaron Lynch, John Goodman, Troy Niklas, Andrew Hendrix, probably a few more.
Which of them have lost playing time or their spot on the depth chart as a result? Riddick lost punt return duty. Carlo was benched for a few minutes. Crist was booted to QB #2 and may be booted to #3 for what – a few questionable choices and 2 turnovers?
4) Is Brian Kelly the right Coach for Notre Dame?
My answer: This is a stupid question to ask half way through his second season. It doesn’t deserve a proper response.
This is the best answer to this question I have seen to date.
Coach is doing a fine job with a full plate. And everything on the plate is not always good.
As far as Tommy Rees goes…there it is…goes. He has heart but lacks real athleticism. Sorry to say it but he can’t cut the mustard. It is time to either give Dane Crist a fair shot or play Hendrix now; no matter what the outcome.
As for USC players crowing, many of them will crow louder minus any college degree and a trip to prison. These guys are thugs. Being in this ‘Sandbox’ over here has given me a clearer perspective as to the nature of what real character is. Few SC players have much in that department. Let them crow. They will be eating it soon enough.
Thanks for your service.
Someone really needs to put a call out to DJ Drew. If he can’t execute game music well, no one can.
Agreed that the music needs some work. The stadium was electric. With the right orchestration and some additional thought to the right music for the moment…the stadium can “rock” the rest of the season. If you take the tv timeouts and crank the whole version of “I’m Shipping Up To Boston” (2:45) just a couple of times during the game the students will take the lead and go nuts singing. It was a good start with a great song…just don’t cut it so short that the fans can’t wail out the lyrics. Would be awesome!
I can speak for the student body in saying that the music needs to stay, but be altered. Crazy train got old fast, but overall the music got us going much more than traditional band songs or chants. Hopefully the administration does their part to make the atmosphere better, just like they asked us to do last week.
I didn’t mind the same music every 3rd down. Most school do that.
Brief notes: Crist = out; Reese = gamer; Hendrix = the future; USC = no class; Music = NFLish; Kelly = keeper. GO IRISH
What I’d like to know is why the last 2 coaches hate to run the ball. Weis and BK are the same guy in this regard. ND has abandoned the run for years. These two guys are good coaches but are also extremely arrogant. It appears to me that this coach and the last have to throw it because that makes them more of an offensive genius than drawing up a simple and straight forward run play. Does anyone remember what the score was at halftime of LSU-ND in our last BCS Bowl appearance? I believe it was 21-14 LSU. Darious Walker had over 100 yds in that half alone. He got the ball about 3 times in 2nd half. BK never, I repeat never seemed to realize last season that every time Hughes was in the game, ND ran the ball effectively. Of course, the last game of the year, he had no choice but draw up run plays for Hughes (Cierre was hurt) and guess what happened, we won. The same thing is happening this year. Yes, Jonas had a costly TO against USF, but the running game has been the only consistent offense ND has had this year. I believe those 2 backs ran the ball a combined 10 times Sat. Once ND got back in the game BK was still hell bent on forcing it in the air with a qb that throws picks with regularity. RUN THE BALL! This will really open things up for Floyd and others! Sheesh
I dont think 1 game where we clearly passed a lot after being down 2 scores early is a fair characterization. BK’s play calls were 45/55 run/pass before SC. That’s pretty balanced.
And that’s just overall. BK is very balanced this season when ND is up, tied, or down by less than 10 points in a game.
I don’t think Crist was given a fair chance this year. He fell apart ( along with the rest of the team) after the Gray fumble vs USF, but I don’t think he should’ve been yanked after 1 half. Maybe I shouldn’t have said Kelly hates Crist. I think Rees should’ve been benched at halftime of the Pitt game. I think Kellys ego prevented him from doing that. I believe we can beat teams like Navy and Maryland with Hendrix getting all the snaps, and he would only get better with experience. Playing Rees anymore just stunts the growth of the entire offense. Nothing personal against Rees, I’m sure he is doing the best he can. He just isn’t talented enough.
Great 5 responses. Well written. The only thing I would add, is that I’d like to see them move on with one of the younger dual threat qb’s and stick with them. If that’s the future, then let’s start now. Rees was interjected into playing time about this same time last year, and won 4 straight with limited offense scheme. I would hope Hendrix could bring at least that to the table and then more. The qb carousel is getting annoying, I’m not anti rees or pr rees or anti crist (that’s weird) or pro crist, but if Hendrix is the guy for future then lets start now. The qb at ND is similar to the qb at Dallas Cowboys etc. Face of the franchise. Let’s rally on that, and keeping plugging away. And start with beating Navy!
GO IRISH!
College football isn’t the NFL, you have a “future” quarterback every 2-4 years. You play with the QB that gives you the best chance to win. We can’t be the Denver Broncos and throw our “future” into the game because we are no where close to being in the running for the playoffs and hope to get him some experience to build off next year. If we did that we wouldn’t ever develop a QB enough to win at all, we’d always be putting the “future” in to play.
Hey Biscuit… thanks for the reality check. Great read, sir!
Re coming out flat, i’m not so sure. the players looked pretty fired up in pregame warmups. I’m tempted to question the play calling. You win the toss and elect to receive. I should thinhk you’d want to be aggressive right off. The first series was not aggressive at all. Did we try to run the ball?
I didn’t like the music. I thought it was lame. I just don’t think it’s us.
And do you really think we were beat that badly? SC kicked our ass in the first qtr. I’d call it even thru midway into the 4th. Even after we fumbled on the 1, we came back and were down 24-17 and had the ball. Kiffin had a plan to beat us and he executed the plan. I didn’t see a plan for us and Kelly and Diaco have yet to show that they can coach with the big boys.
Left to play for? Beat Stanford. but good luck with that. Unless we can learn to defend the pass between now and then, our chances aren’t very good.
I don’t think we came out flat. I think we came out amped and over prepared. Paralysis by Analysis. Multiple plays I saw D make mistakes because they were over pursuing or over analyzing.
Still steaming. Good answers. I believe Kelly is the right guy at the right time. He will get ND back to where we all want it to be. It takes time to change what has been a culture of mediocrity for over a decade. One of the worst parts of this is that we are wasting an amazing talent like Mike Floyd. I could ramble on forever about program building and the “it” factor that some coaches have, but I’m gonna go back to gnashing my teeth and breaking 2×4’s in half. I bought a stack of them yesterday, it’s good therapy.
OK enough about critisizing Kelly’s play calling based on option play. He obviously seen something that he thought it would work or just wanted to see how USC would defend it. It was one play, get over, Kelly was and still is one of the best play callers in the country. I think we’re to the point that if Kelly can’t get it done, no one can. Give the guy a chance, his track record speaks for itself, trust me, he knows what he’s doing
Bottom line to me is that our team, meaning players and coaches, have improved greatly since beginning of 2010. However, they (both players and coaches, but particularly players) are have not yet learned what it takes to win in big game situations, and hence lose their poise, focus and sometimes intensity. Hence the reason we got out physicalled and got our asses handed to us Saturday. These problems are correctible with good coaching and experience. I think we have the good coaches to get over this next hump, but only time will tell.
The comment I received from students is that the music was way, way overdone, and inteferes with the cheers and chants they like to do with the band. As one junior put it after the game (as we drowned our sorrow at the tailgate), the music is not needed when it works the best (i.e. we are playing well) and does not work when it is needed (i.e. when we play sucky).
3 days late, but my thoughts on music:
dropkick murphys to start each half: unqualified success.
welcome to the jungle following KO return: also incredible (aided by the lack of TV timeout which sustained the momentum)
also agree with others: mic the band & have them play 7 nation army.
@NDfakePR got it right, namely, we need more than the 3 (or 5) song package, but a step in the right direction to see what worked.
as others have posted: less crazy train (perhaps save the audio for 3rd-and-5 or more?)
i was very pleased at the production value — specifically that the band, PA announcer, and piped-in music did not compete with one another, but instead added something new to fill times of silence.